Hoefler Text Ornaments

Harriet Riddle harjitmoe at outlook.com
Sun Jul 24 04:04:27 CDT 2022

For further reference: the Nishiki-teki PUA scheme includes several 
ornaments from the Hoefler, Bodoni and Caslon sets 
(<https://umihotaru.work/nishiki-teki_pua.pdf>). These are not all 
created equal: for example, among the Caslon ornaments encoded there, 
one can see the English Rose, Scottish Thistle and Irish Harp embelms 
(PUA+FEF95, PUA+FEF96 and PUA+FEF97) for example, which are emblematic 
characters with clear identity and traditional meanings of their own 
(not incomparable with the aforementioned French fleur-de-lis), but one 
can also see a large number of nondescript and largely fungible 
arabesques for which distinct semantic usages are highly improbable.


James Kass via Unicode wrote:
> In 11309-apple-resp-n4127, John H. Jenkins wrote,
> "Apple feels that, absent evidence of widespread use, dingbats and 
> similar glyphs are not suitable for general-purpose encoding."
> and
> "Apple feels that, in general, characters should be encoded in the 
> Universal
> Character Set only on the basis of demonstrated need for general text 
> interchange."
> In N4127, Karl Pentzlin noted that no effort was made to determine 
> unification with existing characters, even in cases where unification 
> was obvious.  For example, Hoefler Glyph 57 "ORN-FLEURDELIS" is shown 
> in N4127 with a pointer to U+269C (⚜). So some of the Hoefler 
> ornaments are already exchangeable in Unicode.
> Apple didn't forbid future encoding of Hoefler ornaments, but rather 
> keeps the existing bar of demonstrable usage in place.
> Any proposal to complete the Hoefler repertoire in Unicode would need 
> to carefully examine unification and then show that plain-text 
> interchange is necessary.
> On 2022-07-23 7:04 PM, Rebecca Bettencourt via Unicode wrote:
>> Because Apple has more sense than Microsoft and decided their dingbat 
>> fonts
>> don't need to be in Unicode.
>> Someone back in 2011 collected all the glyphs from Apple's dingbat 
>> fonts:
>> http://unicode.org/wg2/docs/n4127.pdf
>> And Apple provided a response:
>> http://unicode.org/L2/L2011/11309-apple-resp-n4127.pdf
>> -- Rebecca Bettencourt
>> On Sat, Jul 23, 2022 at 6:06 AM Gabriel Tellez via Unicode <
>> unicode at corp.unicode.org> wrote:
>>> I don't understand why Wingdings/Webdings and Zapf Dingbats get to 
>>> be in
>>> Unicode but not Hoefler Text Ornaments. (Not going to ask about Apple
>>> Symbols because that's a icon font not a dingbat font)

More information about the Unicode mailing list